Gilbert Cope was “father of genealogical research in Pennsylvania.” His surname collection – scrapbooked records on thousands of surnames. He prepared the first accounts on many early families and twice traveled to the British Isles to abstract English Friends records. In America, Cope saved numerous Quaker meeting records from destruction. Explore FamilySearch to discover if Cope also researched – YOUR Quaker ancestor.
Wednesday, January 22
10:00 am to 11:15 am Pacific Time – Fiske Genealogical Library, Seattle (Virtual Class)
In the late 1800s, the new state of Washington promised peace and prosperity to new settlers. At least thirty-three African American men who had served during the Civil War answered the call. Paul Barrows, a former legislator from Mississippi, established the Calvary Baptist Church of Spokane. Gideon H. Stump Bailey became the first African American justice of the peace in Franklin. Allin Alfred Hawkins, born into slavery, became one of the wealthiest African American farmers in the Yakima Valley. In her presentation, author Cynthia A. Wilson will tell the stories of these men and other courageous African American veterans who settled in Washington State after the Civil War. Ms. Wilson’s book, “Black Civil War Veterans in Washington State” was published recently in June 2024.
Wednesday, January 29
10:00 am to 11:15 am Pacific Time – Fiske Genealogical Library, Seattle (Virtual Class)
Jumping the Pond: Connecting Immigrants to Their Homeland
Are you and your ancestors tired of hanging out in US records? Ready to get back to Europe? In this presentation Mary Roddy will cover a methodology for finding your ancestor’s place of origin. You’ll learn about a host of records that might provide a location or clues toward finding one. Mary’s got a spreadsheet trick for squeezing the most out of passenger lists and a couple of ideas for when all else fails. Finally she’ll present a couple of case studies where she connected immigrants back to their home in Europe.
Wednesday, February 5
10:00 am to 11:15 am Pacific Time – Fiske Genealogical Library, Seattle (Virtual Class)
Meet Your New Research Assistant: AI for Genealogists
Discover how AI can act as your personal research assistant. This class will introduce you to AI tools like ChatGPT and FamilySearch’s full text search, offering practical tips and techniques to save time, find hidden records, and enhance the accuracy of your family history research.
Wednesday, February 12
10:00 am to 11:15 am Pacific Time – Fiske Genealogical Library, Seattle (Virtual Class)
Ten Things Every Eastern European Genealogist Should Know
Learn how to maximize your Eastern European genealogy research with the ten key things to know before you even begin. Topics to be addressed: Tips for planting your family tree online, determining names and places, pinpointing places, the best online databases for getting what you need and practices for citing sources and recording information, and what to expect when you cross the pond.
Wednesday, February 19
10:00 am to 11:15 am Pacific Time – Fiske Genealogical Library, Seattle (Virtual Class)
A Demographic Study of Siroke, Slovakia in the 1800s
Censuses and Church records are great sources to find ancestors, but taken as a whole, these documents can provide a wealth of statistical information about a population. I have collected such data for one of my ancestral hometowns, Siroke in Eastern Slovakia, to build a picture of the daily life my great-grandfather knew as a boy before he came to America: occupations, family sizes, at what age people married, how long they lived and causes of death, etc. Lacking any direct stories about my older ancestors, this is a good way to present a picture of their world. Although it is one small farming town in a small country, the picture of peasant life is probably similar to towns all across Europe just before the Industrial Revolution.
Wednesday, February 26
10:00 am to 11:15 am Pacific Time – Fiske Genealogical Library, Seattle (Virtual Class)
Using Irish Naming Convention to Discover the Family of Thomas Delaney in Mid-Nineteenth Century Ireland
Thomas Delaney was the father of Catherine “Kate: Delaney who married Henry Burge on 5 November 1878 in Dublin, Ireland. Catherine was born about 1860-62 in Queen’s County (present day County Laois) in Ireland and died 24 March 1909 in Dublin. To learn more about Thomas, evidence was gathered from researching the life and family of his daughter, Kate and her husband Henry. This evidence identified a specific geographical location to focus the search for records for Thomas. This case study shows how Irish naming convention can be used as a powerful tool to analyze and predict family names and aid in the search for family units in Irish records in the mid to late 1800s.
Wednesday, March 12
10:00 am to 11:15 am Pacific Time – Fiske Genealogical Library, Seattle (Virtual Class)
YOUR ANCESTOR’S OCCUPATION – Exploring the 1821 Irish Census
In Ireland all of our ancestors had an occupation. While some might later change their name, few changed their trade or means of making a living. When used in combination with other factors, an occupation can be a powerful tool to help identify OUR ancestor, among the hundreds of same named Irish immigrants. Explore the occupations outlined in Irelands’ 1821 Census for the town of Ballyhaise in County Cavan. It’s records are among a handful of remaining census fragments, which were not destroyed by the Public Records Office fire in 1921.
Monthly Meeting & Presentation – After You’re Gone:
Future Proofing Your Genealogy Research
Tuesday, January 14th
1:00 pm
SVGS Library
6111 188 PL NE, Arlington, WA
You are invited to this free presentation at the SVGS library.
Everyone is welcome!
Thomas MacEntee will be speaking virtually at our January 14th meeting. Our monthly business meeting will follow the presentation.
Thomas’ Topic: After You’re Gone: Future Proofing Your Genealogy Research
When it comes to your years of genealogy research and material, what plans have you
made to ensure that it doesn’t die with you? Thomas will provide some advice on creating a realistic plan to get your “genealogy affairs” in order so that the next generation of researchers can benefit from your years of hard work. A syllabus for this presentation may be found on the SVGS website www.stillygen.org
Thomas’ Bio: What happens when a “tech guy” with a love for history gets laid off during The Great Recession of 2008? You get Thomas MacEntee, a genealogy professional who is also a blogger, educator, author, social media connector, online community builder and more. Thomas’ website https://genealogybargains.com
There will be a short break with refreshments. The monthly meeting will follow.
DIG – DNA Special Interest Group
Also join us at the SVGS library from 1-3pm on Thursday, January 16thfor our DNA Special Interest Group (DIG). This group works together to develop a better understanding of DNA techniques and strategies for finding relatives, discuss and review new DNA developments and tools and help members with their research problems. This group meets at the same time on the 3rd Thursday of the month.
All DNA skill levels are welcome to attend.
If you have a specific DNA topic you would like to discuss or have any other suggestions for this group, please sen an email info@stillygen.org
Also, if you have not joined us yet and would like to receive emails in the future for the DIG group, please send an email to info@stillygen.org and request to be added to the DIG email list.
New England Interest Group
The SVGS New England Interest Group (includes New York and Pennsylvania) that meets at the SVGS Library on the first Tuesday of the month is now hybrid!
If you have not joined us yet and would like to receive emails in the future for this group or wish to attend via Zoom, please send an email to info@stillygen.org and request to be added to the New England Interest Group email list and receive monthly Zoom invitations.
January is named after Janus, the Roman god of beginnings, endings and transitions. Janus was the god of doors and gates and was often depicted with two faces, one looking forward and one looking backward. This is fitting for a new year!
We owe Julius Caesar thanks for reforming the Roman calendar to establish the beginning of the year in January. (So stated Wikipedia.)On this day, Romans simultaneously remembered the past year and looked forward to the coming year. They would make offerings of wine and incense to Janus and exchanged gifts of dates, dried figs and honey to usher in a sweet and peaceful new year.
January has some important official and unofficial holidays:
* Martin Luther King, Jr. Day on the third Monday in January
*January 14: Dress Up Your Pet Day
*January 19: Popcorn Day
*January 24: Belly Laughs Day
*January 28: Kazoo Day! (Look it up 🙂 !!!)
If you, or your ancestor, was born in January by the 19th, you’re a Capricorn and such folks are said to be idiosyncratic and genteel. If born after the 19th, but before February 18th, you’re said to be an Aquarius, said to be assertive and open-minded. REALLY????
AmericanAncestors.org is a website offering a million (well, close) ways to help you find your early American ancestor. For instance, these are FREE webinars at www.americanancestors.org/events
13 Feb: Researching Famine Irish Ancestors in Ireland’s Poor Laws
13 Mar: Friend or Foe: Researching colonial Ancestors During the American Revolution
17 Apr: Best Published Sources for Colonial New England Research
13 May: English Immigration to the American Colonies
12 Jun: Best Published Sources for German Research in America
17 Jul: Top Repositories for Researching Upstate New York
Surely viewing these FREE webinars would help you??????
Here are some Sad & True Genealogy Rules Your Ancestors Followed…shared to guide your research in 2025:
* Thou salt be consistent in naming male children; only acceptable names are: James, John, Joseph, William and Thomas.
*Ditto for female children: Mary, Elizabeth, Ann and Sarah.
*Thou shalt never write down the surname of female children on any document.
*Thou shalt, after naming children from the approved list, call them by nicknames: Polly, Dolly, Sukey, Tommy or Billy.
*Thou shalt never write a surname legibly: let them guess!
*Thou shalt discard any documents created prior to your grandparents’ time; descendants really won’t care.
*Thou shalt bury your people on your land without a headstone.
*Thou shalt leave no family Bible records nor letters or diaries.
*Thou shalt never enter a courthouse to sign any legal documents.
*Thou shalt promote and propagate misleading legends, rumors and vague innuendos regarding ancestral information to mislead descendants.
TIP OF THE WEEK – FIND AN ANCESTOR’S NEIGHBORHOOD IN THE CENSUS, EVEN IF THEY DIDN’T OWN PROPERTY
If you have an ancestor who didn’t own property and whose location isn’t clear in the census records — maybe the township or division no longer exists, and no census maps are available for that time period. One way to narrow down a location is to look for landowners listed next to your ancestor in a census. See if you can find the location of the neighbor’s land. Since census records were often taken door to door, these people likely lived nearby. Cross examine multiple neighbors property locations through plat maps, deed records and patents to find an estimated location for your family.
Join SGS Today
to renew your membership: log in on the Members Home page and click the green renew membership button. January 1, 2025
SGS eNews! comes out the first of every month. contact eNews!
Join Us for Our Annual Holiday Celebration in the SGS Library at the Good Shepherd Center
With the holiday rush over, let’s celebrate the new year. Bring cookies to share and say hello to your SGS friends in person at the library. Come early, come late (but not too late).
Stick around to join us for the Second Saturday Zoom presentation by Rebecca Whitman Koford at 1 p.m.
Catch (or ask for) a demo of library subscriptions and/or equipment
Do you have family history in the Northwest? If so you are likely to benefit from records held by the National Archives at Seattle. This facility maintains and provides access to permanent records created by federal agencies and courts in Alaska, Idaho, Oregon, and Washington.
This tour will be Friday, January 17 at 9:30 a.m. It is limited to 20 people.
SECOND SATURDAY PRESENTATION TO HIGHLIGHT RESEARCH LOGS
Organizing is key to understanding. If you can’t find it, how can you compare and analyze the facts and clues in your ancestor’s life? Presenter Rebecca Whitman Koford, Vice President of the National Genealogical Society, will introduce three organizational tools that researches can benefit from using. These include strategic use of timelines, and how they can work together to improve your analysis skills and get closer to finding the answers you need.
This presentation will be offered via Zoom Saturday, January 11 at 1 p.m.
NEXT MONTH: “I Have a Civil War Ancestor: Now What?” Presented by Brian Rhinehart, Saturday, February 8, at 1 p.m. Sign up separately for this event.
SLOTS STILL AVAILABLE FOR GET ORGANIZED CLASS
SGS’s “Organizing for Genealogy” class still has openings. This course will help participants create a system of organization or adapt their current system to meet their specific research needs. The class will be offered over four weeks in February with an option to attend either Monday evenings (7:00 to 9:00 p.m.) or Tuesday afternoons (1:00 to 3:00 p.m.).
Session 1: Organizing Our Self – Our thoughts, actions, time, and space
Session 2: Organizing Our System – Paper systems and Digital Systems
Session 3: Organizing Our Workflow – Research, Records, and Resources
Session 4: Pulling it all together – Developing a tailored organization system
Each class series is limited to 20 participants. Class Fee: $80 (SGS members $60)
SCANDINAVIAN SIG TO SHARE TIPS SEEKING NORWEGIAN AND SWEDISH RECORDS
Join Karen and Kathi on Sunday, January 12th at 1PM via Zoom as they reveal tips for searching Norwegian and Swedish records on both free and subscription sites. Plus, bring your questions— we’ll be answering all your burning inquiries about tracing your ancestors! The Scandinavian SIG was restarted about 10 years ago by Karen Knudson and has a co-leader Kathi M., SGS librarian. The group meets quarterly. See the SGS calendar of events at segensoc.org to register.
MEXICAN SIG LAUNCHES JANUARY 9
Share information and discuss Indigenous North American, Spanish, Cuban, and Hispanic genealogical research. The inaugural meeting for this SIG will be Thursday, January 9th, at 7:00 p.m., via Zoom. Contact Diane Hughes-Hart via Education@seagensoc.org to join.
NEW SIGS IN PLANNING STAGES
SGS is planning to add three new Special Interest Groups. Each of these groups are in early development. Would you be interested in being a co-leader or a participant? Let us know of your interest and availability/preferences for meeting day and time. Please send us an email with your information.
Ancestry.com Ancestry.com has become one of the largest genealogical websites available today. With vast records collections and extensive tree building tools, there’s much to explore and optimize. If you would like to gain greater insight into this site or want to share your knowledge with others, please email: Education@seagensoc.org (Subject: Ancestry SIG).
Eastern Europe Eastern Europe is a regions with a rich and complex history and diverse ethic groups. It’s frequent border changes, language barriers and influences from several powerful empires can lead to challenges when researching family history. Share information and questions about this fascinating region. To get involved email: Education@seagensoc.org (Subject: Eastern Europe SIG).
Artificial intelligence The explosive growth in AI has lead to many applications for it in genealogical research. Do you use AI in your research or want to learn more about how to do so? Email: Education@seagensoc.org (Subject: AI SIG).
LIBRARY NEWS:
Evening Hours at SGS Library to Be Offered Once a Month
SGS is offering evening hours once a month at the library starting this month. The library will be open from 6:00 p.m. to 8:30 p.m. every 3rd Wednesday of the month through April when the success of the endeavor will be reevaluated. If it proves popular these hours could continue past April. So use it or lose it. Come to the libary Wednesday nights January 15, February 19 … and show SGS that you want these additional hours.
Get Help Scanning Photos, Learn More About the Library; Tours to Be Offered Once a Month Want to know more about how the SGS library can help your research? With so many resources available it can be easy to overlook something that may be helpful. To help patrons learn more about the library and get help using the photo/document scanner, the SGS library will be offering tours every 4th Saturday of the month. The tour will start at 10:30 a.m. and will be followed by assistance scanning documents and photos. The first tour will be Saturday, January 25, followed by February 22. Show up and let SGS know if this is a program that should be continued.
SGS CALENDAR OF EVENTS
Good Shepherd Center, Suite 302 4649 Sunnyside Ave N Seattle, WA 98103 206 522-8658
Always check the SGS Website Calendar of Events for the meeting links, registration, or for last minute updates or changes to the schedule. Be advised you may need to register in advance to join a meeting.
All times listed are Pacific Time unless otherwise noted
Saturday, Jan. 4, 2025, 10:15 a.m.- 12:15 p.m., FamilySearch SIG, Discover the many ways to use the FamilySearch website in your research. Meeting includes instruction and time for Q&A. Email Lou to get on the email list: loudaly@nwlink.com.
Monday, Jan. 6, 2025, 10:00 a.m.-11:30 a.m., Brags & Bricks Social Interest Group (Virtual), Join us for an informal social gathering. Share your recent genealogical successes and challenges, or just come to hang out with other genealogists. Remember the new Zoom link started this month.
Wednesday, Jan. 8, 2025, 6:30 p.m.-7:30 p.m., Pacific Northwest Interest Group (Virtual), Share information and discuss Pacific Northwest genealogical research. Register on the SGS website.
Wednesday, Jan. 8 2025, 7:00 p.m.-9:00 p.m., MAC Computer SIG, Jointly sponsored by SGS and Fiske. Meetings address topics and resources for Macintosh (Apple) computers and the Reunion genealogy software program. A link to login will be sent to the MAC SIG email list. If you would like to join, send an email to macusersig@seagensoc.org to be added to the email list.
Thursday, Jan. 9, 2025, 7:00 p.m.-8:30 a.m., Mexican SIG (Virtual), Share information and discuss Indigenous North American, Spanish, Cuban, and Hispanic genealogical research. Email Education@seagensoc.org to join.
Saturday, Jan. 11, 2025, 10:00 a.m.-3:00 p.m., Holiday Open House, Join us for our annual holiday celebration in the SGS library at the Good Shepherd Center. Bring cookies to share and say hello to your SGS friends IN PERSON at the library. Come early, come late (not too late). Stay for the Second Saturday Zoom presentation.
Saturday, Jan. 11, 2025, 1:00 a.m.-2:30 p.m., Second Saturday, “Research Logs: Write or Regret It!” Presented by Rebecca Whitman Koford. Organizing is key to understanding. This presentation introduces three organizational tools, including strategic use of timelines, and how they can work together to improve your analysis skills and get closer to finding the answers you need. Register here.
Sunday, Jan. 12, 2025, 1:00 a.m.-3:00 p.m., Scandinavian Interest Group (Virtual), We will be reviewing free and subscription sites for researching records in Sweden and Norway. hosts Karen Knudson and Kathi M. Share information and discuss Scandinavian ancestral research.
Monday, Jan. 13, 2025, 10:00 a.m.-11:30 a.m., Brags & Bricks Social Interest Group (Virtual), Join us for an informal social gathering. Share your recent genealogical successes and challenges, or just come to hang out with other genealogists. Remember the new Zoom link started this month.
Monday, Jan. 13, 2025, 1:00 p.m.-3:00 p.m., SGS Board of Directors Meeting (Virtual), All SGS members are welcome to attend. SGS is an all volunteer organization. Please be involved. Members must sign in to website to see Zoom link.
Tuesday, Jan. 14, 2025, 10:00 a.m.-11:00 a.m., Tech Tuesday (Virtual), informal consultation time on DNA, genealogy software, or genealogy-related technical issues. All are welcome. No appointment necessary. Bring us your problem; we’ll try to help.
Wednesday, Jan. 15, 2025, 6:00 p.m.-8:30 p.m., NEW! SGS Library Evening Hours, SGS library introduces evening hours on a trial basis through April. Every 3rd Wednesday of the month.
Friday, Jan. 17, 2025, 9:30 a.m., SGS Tour of National Archives at Seattle (Field Trips), Docent-led tour of the National Archives at Seattle This facility maintains and provides access to permanent records created by federal agencies and courts in Alaska, Idaho, Oregon, and Washington. Limited to 20 people.
Saturday, Jan. 18, 2025, 1:00 p.m.-3:00 p.m, German SIG (Virtual), Topic to be announced. Register on the SGS website.
Sunday, Jan. 19, 2025, 1:00 pm- 2:30 pm, Virtual Sunday: Something Old, Something New, Get a virtual demo of SGS library online resources. Speaker: Jill Morelli. See the SGS website Calendar of Events for further information. Please register in advance.
Monday, Jan. 20, 2025, 10:00 a.m.-11:30 a.m., Brags & Bricks Social Interest Group (Virtual), Join us for an informal social gathering. Share your recent genealogical successes and challenges, or just come to hang out with other genealogists. Remember the new Zoom link started this month.
Monday, Jan. 20, 2025, 7:00 p.m.-8:30 p.m., Write It Up! SIG (Virtual), Join this group to share and discuss writing projects, resources, and ideas. To join or learn more, contact SGS Director of Education (education@seagensoc.org).
Tuesday, Jan. 21, 2025, 10:00 a.m.-12:00 p.m., “Pass It On” Writers’ Group, Create your family history and share with others in an effort to improve your writing. Please note: The Writers’ Group is at the maximum number of participants and is not currently accepting any new members.
Saturday, Jan 25, 2025, 10:00 a.m.-12:30 p.m., DNA SIG, To participate in this quarterly SIG 1you need to be on the SGS DNA Interest Group email list. Contact Cary Bright at SGSDNASIG@seagensoc.org to join.
Saturday, Jan. 25, 2025, 10:30 a.m., NEW! SGS Library Tour/Scanning Help, SGS library introduces tours of the library and help scanning photos and documents. This is a trial basis through April. Every 4th Saturday of the month. Tour starts at 10:30 followed by scanning help.
Monday, Jan. 27, 2025, 10:00 a.m.-11:30 a.m., Brags & Bricks Social Interest Group (Virtual), Join us for an informal social gathering. Share your recent genealogical successes and challenges, or just come to hang out with other genealogists. Remember the new Zoom link started this month.
Tuesday, Jan. 28, 2025, 10:00 a.m.-11:00 a.m., Tech Tuesday (Virtual), informal consultation time on DNA, genealogy software, or genealogy-related technical issues. All are welcome. No appointment necessary. Bring us your problem; we’ll try to help.
Saturday, Feb. 1, 2025, 10:15 a.m.- 12:15 p.m., FamilySearch SIG, Discover the many ways to use the FamilySearch website in your research. Meeting includes instruction and time for Q&A. Email Lou to get on the email list: loudaly@nwlink.com.
Sunday, Feb. 2, 2025, 1:00 pm-3:00 pm, DNA Workshop, with Cary Bright and Craig Gowens. To participate you need to be on the SGS DNA Interest Group email list. Contact Cary Bright at sgsdnasig@seagensoc.org to join.
Monday, Feb. 3, 2025, 10:00 a.m.-11:30 a.m., Brags & Bricks Social Interest Group (Virtual), Join us for an informal social gathering. Share your recent genealogical successes and challenges, or just come to hang out with other genealogists. Remember the new Zoom link started this month.
Wednesday, Feb. 5, 2025, 6:30 p.m.-7:30 p.m., Pacific Northwest Interest Group (Virtual), Share information and discuss Pacific Northwest genealogical research. Register on the SGS website.
Saturday, Feb. 8, 2025, 1:00 a.m.-2:30 p.m., Second Saturday, “I Have a Civil War Ancestor: Now What?” Presented by Brian Rhinehart. Military records can be among the most genealogically significant sources you can find. Register here.
Monday, Feb. 10, 2025, 10:00 a.m.-11:30 a.m., Brags & Bricks Social Interest Group (Virtual), Join us for an informal social gathering. Share your recent genealogical successes and challenges, or just come to hang out with other genealogists. Remember the new Zoom link started this month.
Monday, Feb. 10, 2025, 1:00 p.m.-3:00 p.m., SGS Board of Directors Meeting (Virtual), All SGS members are welcome to attend. SGS is an all volunteer organization. Please be involved. Members must sign in to website to see Zoom link.
** NOTE: There will be no Irish SIG in January.
OUR NEIGHBORS AND BEYOND
“Finding the Origins of an Immigrant Ancestor” (Virtual) Eastside Genealogical Society Thursday, Jan. 9, 2025, 7:00 p.m. (virtual doors open at 6:30 p.m.)
Join Eastside Genealogical Society and Debbie Gurtler, AG and Assistant Director of the FamilySearch Library in Salt Lake City as the explore methods to find the homeland of an immigrant ancestor. This presentation will highlight the methodology and U.S. record types that should help you identify their hometown so you can expand your family tree. A case study highlighting the methodology needed will also be presented. For more information about the event see the EGS website.
Registration opens for AppGen Spring 2025 Classes (Virtual) Wednesday, January 15, 2025
The window for registration for the AppGen 2025 Spring semester will open 15-22 January. It is a random draw, not “first come first served.” For more information see the website.
“AI (Artificial Intelligence) Made Easy: Boosting Your Genealogy Research with Technology” (Virtual) Olympia Genealogical Society Saturday, Feb. 1, 2025, 8:50 a.m.-2:30 p.m.
Speaker Blaine Bettinger, will outline how AI can aid your research. In this 4-hour seminar he will cover:
Using Artificial Intelligence Tools for Genealogy
10 Generative AI Prompts Every Genealogist Needs to Know
Ethical Issues Associated with Generative Artificial Intelligence
Memories in the Digital Age: AI Transcription of Handwritten Diaries
For more information about the event see the OGS website.
Join SGS Today
to renew your membership: log in on the Members Home page and click the green renew membership button. January 1, 2025
SGS eNews! comes out the first of every month. contact eNews!
Tacoma-Pierce County Genealogical Society Writing Family History Wednesday, January 8, 2025, starting at 7:00 PM via Zoom
The Writing Family History Special Interest Group (WFH-SIG) supports TPCGS members in documenting, writing, and preserving their family histories—formally or informally. Monthly meetings will provide a mix of presentations, writing exercises, and peer reviews to help members make progress in their projects.
Meeting invite with links in file attached below
Date & Time: Every month on the Second Wednesday, starting at 7:00 PM Pacific Time
Please download and import the following iCalendar (.ics) files to your calendar system.
You are free to copy articles to any non-commercial web site or message board or printed publication you wish. Don’t bother to ask permission, just do it.
